Number of posts : 890 Age : 43 Localisation : Delta, Colorado Registration date : 2006-11-20
Subject: Chapters 13-16 Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:58 pm
This forum is for thoughts related to Chapters 13-16
Minimoosey
Number of posts : 512 Localisation : Grand Junction, CO Registration date : 2006-11-21
Subject: Re: Chapters 13-16 Sun Jan 28, 2007 5:34 am
Interestingly enough, Oliver transforms into a polite young boy with manners when his situation changes. He gets new clothes, he is shown love and nurturing by the bookstore owner and his housekeeper.
Brownlow sees something in Oliver and trusts him to do an errand for him. I can't help but wonder if the portrait is of Oliver's mother and Brownlow is Oliver's grandfather. This would make it more believable that Brownlow is seeing something else in Oliver.
As soon as he gets back on the streets he gets nabbed and he still seems to have a loyalty to his new friend, Brownlow. Oliver is jeered because of his new clothes. He is stripped of these clothes and now has to go back to his old life.
Kelley Admin
Number of posts : 890 Age : 43 Localisation : Delta, Colorado Registration date : 2006-11-20
Subject: Re: Chapters 13-16 Mon Jan 29, 2007 6:02 am
Poor Oliver, I just felt horrible that he was torn from his new home. In this new arrangement Oliver still would do anything to prove himself to his benefactor or 'the person of power'.
Nancy plays an interesting role in being not only the one who finds and brings Oliver back to Fagin, but also the one who all of a sudden stands up to Sikes and Fagin so they won't beat Oliver. I am not sure why she had such a change of heart all of a sudden??
Minimoosey
Number of posts : 512 Localisation : Grand Junction, CO Registration date : 2006-11-21
Subject: Re: Chapters 13-16 Tue Jan 30, 2007 4:14 am
Nancy - is an interesting character. She puts up with Fagin (who is her boyfriend). She has no choice. She has to be tolerable of Fagin for food and shelter. I am a firm believer that if you have money and/or power you can have more principles than someone who has to give those up for existance. Nancy has to suck it up and be with Fagin to sustain life. If she had more of a solid foundation in her economic situation, I bet she would "be able" to make different choices.
Bottom line, I don't think it was a change of heart, but survival.
Karen
Number of posts : 365 Localisation : Cortez, Colorado Registration date : 2006-11-20
Subject: Re: Chapters 13-16 Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:19 am
I think Marti is right. It is much easier to have moral values when you can afford to. I think that is why middle and upper class both in P &P and in this book can be so judgemental. i believe I do that, today. whe I see someone living in a trailer trash environment, with three kids and under 21, I totally figure it's the girls bad judgement. That is really not fair. I think Nancy has a maternal feeling for Oliver and though she had to do what she was told by fagin, she regrets it.
Subject: Chapters 13-16 
Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:58 pm
