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 Chapters 17-22

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Kelley
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PostSubject: Chapters 17-22   Sun Jan 21, 2007 8:02 pm

This forum is for thoughts related to Chapters 17-22
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Minimoosey

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PostSubject: Re: Chapters 17-22   Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:33 pm

First, I have to say that I think the little sick boy, Dick maybe has some parallels to Charles Dickens in real life as a boy. Dick is part of Dickens. Charles Dickens as a boy has to stop school and be independent at age 12. Oliver at 11 (I think). Maybe Charles Dickens felt distraught and hopeless when he was that young. Maybe he thought that he would rather die young than go through the misery of being poor and working your whole life.

Anyway, the next thought is the old addage, nature vs. nurture. Oliver's inner character is sweet, kind and timid. No matter what environment he is put in he still shows those qualities. Oliver is taken advantage of with the Jew and is appreciated when he is with Brownlow.

Mr. Brownlow has an inner turmoil with Oliver's behavior. He stated that he is alone now, and he heart has been broken, but it is not closed. He wants to give Oliver a chance in his heart. I think that it was admirable that he took out that reward to find out what happened to Oliver, but it surprises me that he would believe the first person who showed up with a story for him (even though it is a preacher). The housekeeper will probably needle Mr. Brownlow to give the situation a chance.

It is a shame that Oliver was going to wake up the people during the robbery, but got shot first. Dickens let good prevail last time when Oliver was caught injustly for pickpocketing.

I thought that Mr. Bumble was a crude man. He, of course, was cruel to the orphan's, but he was also a low life thief too. He wanted to get all he could out of Mr. Brownlow for the information about Oliver. Remember that the monastaries also had the burden of the poverty population, if not by taxes, but by placing them in homes in their communities.
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Karen

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PostSubject: Re: Chapters 17-22   Tue Jan 30, 2007 7:20 pm

I think you are correct, Marti. Dickens is writing in part an auto biography.
I thought it was interesting in an earlier chapter that Dickens aluded that Oliver could read and now we have him reading a book. I did not get the impression that he was tauht to read at the workhouse!
I was surprised too that Mr Brownlow would so easily believe Bumble, I guess because bumble was described in such a despicable manner that it would be obvious that he was a no good.
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Minimoosey

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PostSubject: Re: Chapters 17-22   Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:57 pm

I'm really starting to believe that in that day and time a "man's" statement or testament is taken very seriously. There was no judicial system as we know it. A testament from someone is all they have.

If someone vows for him that is as good as gold. In the future chapters we will see that it is the case also.

I didn't pick that up that Oliver might not have learned how to read at the workhouse. Good point.
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Kelley
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PostSubject: Re: Chapters 17-22   Wed Jan 31, 2007 5:39 pm

It's funny that you mention Oliver's reading, because that also struck me as very implausible when I read that section. He can read at high levels and he has strong speech patterns, instead of using street slang, both of which I thought were unlikely for his upbringing.

I agree with you Marti, that a "mans" word seems to carry quite a bit of weight during these times, regardless of their appearance, then again it could be because the of Bumble's position with in the church, that made him seem more reliable.
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Chapters 17-22
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