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 Section II

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Kelley
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PostSubject: Section II   Mon Jan 15, 2007 11:47 pm

This area is for all comments and discussion about the second section of Gulliver's Travels.
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Minimoosey

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PostSubject: Re: Section II   Tue Jan 16, 2007 12:48 am

How funny, now we are dealing with the "giants." I noticed he puts all his effort into going on display for the farmer. No resistance.

I can't help but wonder, he doesn't really miss his family that much. I assume this because he doesn't talk about them. After he moves to the castle, he is still willing to be on show. He gets personally degrated by the Maids of Honour. The Brobdingnagians are governed by a sense of honor. Why don't they see that Gulliver has his own honor he needs to preserve. Why doesn't the Queen/King take him seriously on important matters, even just to discuss them with him.

Gulliver's perspective changes too. In Lilliput he earns the trust of the Emperor to gain liberty. I guess that is trying to deal with him on the same level.

In Brobdingnag he consents with the lifestyle that is handed to him and stays a lot longer too. Accidents happen to him and he still has a forgiving attitude. They look down on him in more ways than one.

When Gulliver killed the rat with his sword, he wanted and needed the approval of the farmer's wife. Why?
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PostSubject: Re: Section II   Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:10 am

One thing I would like to add is the importance of spirit. Gulliver had a strong spirit. I can't figure out how he tolerated the treatment at the Brobdingnagian Island.

With spirit comes drive, and that is translated to Swift's real life of religious freedom. Swift found a way to express himself in literature.

I'm sure not the first one.
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Kelley
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PostSubject: Section II   Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:43 pm

I think that Swift uses both Lilliput and Brobdingnag, and the comparisons between how each culture interacts with Gulliver to shed light on the cultural flaws in England.

Swift makes note of the pride, and almost pokes fun at the Lilliputians, for their feelings of self importance. Then in Brobdingnag, Gulliver's pride and self importance when discussing England, shows the parallels and pokes a bit of fun.

Swift also uses a few other examples to draw attention to the flaws of his culture. We feel sorry for Gulliver when he is 'worked to the bone' performing for the entertainment of the masses, to make money for his 'master'. But as we read did we remember the 'minature cattle' that Gulliver himself took to England, to make money by parading them??
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Minimoosey

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PostSubject: Re: Section II   Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:33 pm

I read in the Spark Notes analysis that the tiny size of Gulliver's physical characteristic is matched with their moral weakness of Europe.

Gulliver's loyality to England confuses me. Swift is morally disguisted with England, but deep down he is still loyal. This goes back to your comment of pride.

Why do you think that Swift puts Gulliver on both ends of the candle, being small in the society and being a giant in the society? I can't figure it out. (Ex. him being put on show like you said and then him taking the miniature cow.)

This was the most entertaining chapter so far. I think because the parallel of both islands. What was Swift trying to accomplish with these comparisions? Maybe all the different characteristics and problems in society of England. Maybe in that day and time, that was the way that he expressed his disagreement with the society and politics of England.
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Kelley
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PostSubject: Re: Section II   Thu Jan 18, 2007 3:10 am

I think that Swift places Gulliver in both situations to make the reader see the pros and cons of each society, and then seeing how those relate directly to Gulliver and his country, as well as us the readers and our countries.
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PostSubject: Re: Section II   Thu Jan 18, 2007 6:58 am

Good point Kelley.

Marti
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Karen

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PostSubject: Re: Section II   Sat Jan 20, 2007 3:22 pm

The Brobdingnagians symbolize the private side of humans when examined up close. This is made very evident because gulliver is so small and the tiniest things are forced to be up close and personal for him. —Some aspects of the Brobdingnaians are disgusting, as they are for all human kind. We got a little taste of what it might have been like for the liliputians when gulliver had to urinate the first time and what a massive flow it was, as well as having to servants assigned to move his massive excrement away each day. I like to think that gulliver experiences both sides of the coin.
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PostSubject: Karen   Sat Jan 20, 2007 6:52 pm

Good point Karen, it is almost disturbing to think about what it would be like to be under a microscope all the time. All of our flaws large and unavoidable, pores, zits, gas, excrement, bo. Wow.
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